1 00:00:51,310 --> 00:00:54,724 [theme music playing] 2 00:01:01,517 --> 00:01:04,724 MAN: There's this thing inside of me, it's like... 3 00:01:04,827 --> 00:01:05,724 the appetite. 4 00:01:05,827 --> 00:01:08,862 It's like a wolf that's... 5 00:01:08,965 --> 00:01:11,517 filling...the hunger. 6 00:01:11,620 --> 00:01:16,000 ♪♪ 7 00:01:19,551 --> 00:01:20,896 MAN: It has happened again. 8 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,689 Still again, a woman has been found murdered 9 00:01:23,793 --> 00:01:26,000 in one of the most painful forms of murder. 10 00:01:26,103 --> 00:01:28,620 MAN they found the nude body of 11 00:01:28,724 --> 00:01:29,965 a 43-year-old woman. 12 00:01:30,068 --> 00:01:31,827 The victim has been identified as 13 00:01:31,931 --> 00:01:34,034 Donna Bennett Johnston of Baton Rouge. 14 00:01:34,137 --> 00:01:36,310 The cause of death -- strangulation. 15 00:01:48,413 --> 00:01:49,793 MAN Sean Gillis is Baton Rouge's 16 00:01:49,896 --> 00:01:51,137 latest suspected serial killer. 17 00:01:51,241 --> 00:01:52,482 The most recent homicide -- 18 00:01:52,586 --> 00:01:54,448 43-year-old Donna Bennett Johnston. 19 00:02:58,724 --> 00:03:01,000 It's interesting that Gillis had a live-in 20 00:03:01,103 --> 00:03:03,655 partner and fulfilled the role of step-parent. 21 00:03:03,758 --> 00:03:06,068 We do see this sometimes with individuals who 22 00:03:06,172 --> 00:03:07,379 are psychopathic. 23 00:03:07,482 --> 00:03:10,551 They live a public life that appears on paper to look like 24 00:03:10,655 --> 00:03:11,827 everybody else. 25 00:03:11,931 --> 00:03:13,655 Gillis wants to blend in, 26 00:03:13,758 --> 00:03:16,517 which is part of how I think he lured his victims in. 27 00:03:51,551 --> 00:03:53,620 SAHNI: She's not even really able to fight back. 28 00:03:53,724 --> 00:03:55,206 I think that's where you see a streak of 29 00:03:55,310 --> 00:03:59,310 sadism in him that even in this very focused kill 30 00:03:59,413 --> 00:04:01,517 that was quick, by his own description, 31 00:04:01,620 --> 00:04:06,000 he still needed that moment for her to plead, to beg. 32 00:04:06,103 --> 00:04:08,793 I think that it was a necessary first step 33 00:04:08,896 --> 00:04:11,172 to start the process of the arousal for him. 34 00:05:20,172 --> 00:05:23,241 BERRILL: His willingness to act this out and make his arms 35 00:05:23,344 --> 00:05:25,206 go limp and demonstrate 36 00:05:25,310 --> 00:05:28,172 what a dead body might look like hanging out of a trunk -- 37 00:05:28,275 --> 00:05:30,344 it just moves, you know, 38 00:05:30,448 --> 00:05:33,586 the theatrical dimension of his behavior forward 39 00:05:33,689 --> 00:05:37,655 and also gives you some clue as to the kind of fantasies 40 00:05:37,758 --> 00:05:39,655 that he has -- have complete 41 00:05:39,758 --> 00:05:44,137 control over the body as if it were a doll or an object is 42 00:05:44,241 --> 00:05:46,068 apparently amusing to him. 43 00:05:46,172 --> 00:05:49,689 SAHNI: The photography allowed him to have a token to take with 44 00:05:49,793 --> 00:05:52,862 him to relive the crime, and the purpose of reliving 45 00:05:52,965 --> 00:05:56,137 the crime, when someone is a sexual sadist is 46 00:05:56,241 --> 00:05:59,103 to recreate that arousal sexually for themselves. 47 00:05:59,206 --> 00:06:02,379 Those days when he felt bored or flat or disengaged, 48 00:06:02,482 --> 00:06:04,482 which is very common for psychopaths, 49 00:06:04,586 --> 00:06:06,172 those photographs fill that void. 50 00:07:21,551 --> 00:07:24,241 BERRILL: He was suggesting to the profiler 51 00:07:24,344 --> 00:07:26,896 that this is every boy's fantasy. 52 00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:29,931 Now, is it really? 53 00:07:30,034 --> 00:07:31,689 You know, I think he is mistaken, 54 00:07:31,793 --> 00:07:35,448 but it lets you know, from an early age, that there was 55 00:07:35,551 --> 00:07:37,344 something wrong with him. 56 00:07:37,448 --> 00:07:38,896 SAHNI: When you're dealing with someone who's 57 00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:41,275 this psychopathic, you have to take a lot of 58 00:07:41,379 --> 00:07:42,655 what they're saying with a grain of salt, 59 00:07:42,758 --> 00:07:45,931 because a very cliche stereotypical belief a lot of 60 00:07:46,034 --> 00:07:47,620 criminals have is that 61 00:07:47,724 --> 00:07:50,827 psychologists have this anchored belief that boys want 62 00:07:50,931 --> 00:07:51,931 to have sex with their moms. 63 00:07:52,034 --> 00:07:54,793 So this is really him playing to the profiler. 64 00:07:54,896 --> 00:07:56,724 He wants to be studied. Okay, come study me. 65 00:07:56,827 --> 00:07:58,827 I'm such an interesting, complex person. 66 00:07:58,931 --> 00:08:02,275 So he's giving her what he thinks she wants to hear. 67 00:08:27,344 --> 00:08:29,172 BERRILL: He compared her to a Barbie doll, 68 00:08:29,275 --> 00:08:33,034 something lifeless, nonetheless, arousing for him. 69 00:08:33,137 --> 00:08:37,655 The average person would find this grotesque. 70 00:08:37,758 --> 00:08:39,724 He likes it better if they're dead, 71 00:08:39,827 --> 00:08:43,034 because therefore, there's no conversation. 72 00:08:43,137 --> 00:08:46,413 There's no being challenged on his motives 73 00:08:46,517 --> 00:08:48,931 or his desires, 74 00:08:49,034 --> 00:08:51,551 and therefore, he can revel in his 75 00:08:51,655 --> 00:08:53,448 perverse fantasies. 76 00:08:53,551 --> 00:08:56,206 This gives us a window into 77 00:08:56,310 --> 00:08:58,724 where Gillis's fantasies may have begun. 78 00:08:58,827 --> 00:09:02,379 He had to plot and correct and reform 79 00:09:02,482 --> 00:09:04,413 and restage the fantasy in his mind 80 00:09:04,517 --> 00:09:07,379 before he actually went out and started hunting real live women. 81 00:10:19,931 --> 00:10:22,206 SAHNI: So there's that hunting behavior, getting to know 82 00:10:22,310 --> 00:10:23,482 his specimen, 83 00:10:23,586 --> 00:10:26,482 his kill -- being in the zone is really that high. 84 00:10:26,586 --> 00:10:29,206 Once he gets locked and loaded on the idea that he's gonna go 85 00:10:29,310 --> 00:10:32,379 kill again and torture, he's ready to go do it. 86 00:11:16,896 --> 00:11:18,965 BERRILL: Well, then who took the pleasure? 87 00:11:19,068 --> 00:11:22,379 What is he blaming? His brain and not himself. 88 00:11:22,482 --> 00:11:25,655 So that's where you see, he's being disingenuous. 89 00:11:25,758 --> 00:11:28,068 It comes across as bologna. 90 00:11:28,172 --> 00:11:29,689 SAHNI: He's splitting off parts of himself, 91 00:11:29,793 --> 00:11:31,620 There's the monster, there's the brain, 92 00:11:31,724 --> 00:11:33,482 and these things are different than Gillis. 93 00:11:33,586 --> 00:11:35,758 That's what he's essentially saying to us -- it's not true. 94 00:11:35,862 --> 00:11:37,551 We understand it's all part and parcel of 95 00:11:37,655 --> 00:11:41,310 himself as one collective person who's doing these acts. 96 00:11:41,413 --> 00:11:42,931 But I think there's a part of him 97 00:11:43,034 --> 00:11:45,689 that does struggle to understand his own fantasies. 98 00:12:21,586 --> 00:12:24,586 SAHNI: It's important to note that he incapacitated 99 00:12:24,689 --> 00:12:26,758 her by running her over with his car. 100 00:12:26,862 --> 00:12:28,724 There was no fighting for her life. 101 00:12:28,827 --> 00:12:30,655 There was no begging, there was no pleading, 102 00:12:30,758 --> 00:12:33,551 and a sadist needs that arousal, 103 00:12:33,655 --> 00:12:35,172 creating fear in someone, 104 00:12:35,275 --> 00:12:39,206 and so maybe he is learning something about 105 00:12:39,310 --> 00:12:41,655 what turns him on and what turns him off. 106 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:31,034 SAHNI: Whether it happened or not is almost irrelevant. 107 00:13:31,137 --> 00:13:37,034 Gillis is giving us a window into how clear 108 00:13:37,137 --> 00:13:39,931 his sexual fantasies were and how far back 109 00:13:40,034 --> 00:13:43,103 they go, and there is a component of the need for them 110 00:13:43,206 --> 00:13:45,689 to be dead and unresponsive. 111 00:13:45,793 --> 00:13:48,000 These things are not about relationships. 112 00:13:48,103 --> 00:13:51,448 These things are about objectification and power 113 00:13:51,551 --> 00:13:53,862 because he wants him dead. 114 00:13:53,965 --> 00:13:58,344 It's a really twisted way of pursuing your sexual interests, 115 00:13:58,448 --> 00:14:00,551 making death of precursor. 116 00:14:00,655 --> 00:14:03,068 To be this murderous and perverse, 117 00:14:03,172 --> 00:14:06,724 you have to have a well of despair and emptiness. 118 00:15:22,896 --> 00:15:25,000 SAHNI: This is victim number seven. 119 00:15:25,103 --> 00:15:28,965 He likely is also experiencing a greater need for intensity, 120 00:15:29,068 --> 00:15:31,034 for that thrill and that high, 121 00:15:31,137 --> 00:15:34,241 which means it takes more and more to get the same rise 122 00:15:34,344 --> 00:15:36,103 and maybe killing somebody close to him 123 00:15:36,206 --> 00:15:38,344 gave him that arousal that he wanted. 124 00:15:38,448 --> 00:15:40,000 I mean, 125 00:15:40,103 --> 00:15:42,689 I was willing to kill someone I knew, 126 00:15:42,793 --> 00:15:46,206 because I had this kind of itch -- that is frightening. 127 00:15:46,310 --> 00:15:51,172 You kind of get a feel for how disturbed he really is. 128 00:16:26,103 --> 00:16:30,034 BERRILL: He's reflecting a kind of tender attitude, and the fact 129 00:16:30,137 --> 00:16:32,655 that he would paint her fingernails, 130 00:16:32,758 --> 00:16:34,620 essentially pretty her up, does 131 00:16:34,724 --> 00:16:36,862 suggest something a little bit fetishistic. 132 00:16:36,965 --> 00:16:40,758 It's a very peculiar behavior, and it harkens back to 133 00:16:40,862 --> 00:16:43,551 his mother, dressing her up like a Barbie doll. 134 00:16:43,655 --> 00:16:47,586 SAHNI: For Gillis, human beings aren't whole entities. 135 00:16:47,689 --> 00:16:50,241 They're a compilation of parts, sort of how 136 00:16:50,344 --> 00:16:53,482 he talked about his brain being different than him. 137 00:16:53,586 --> 00:16:57,172 I find myself wondering whether those hands are 138 00:16:57,275 --> 00:17:01,137 reminiscent of some earlier experiences that he had had. 139 00:18:19,275 --> 00:18:21,689 SAHNI: This display of emotion is synthetic. 140 00:18:21,793 --> 00:18:23,482 It doesn't appear to be sincere or real, 141 00:18:23,586 --> 00:18:25,034 and I think it's a load of crap. 142 00:18:25,137 --> 00:18:27,965 You have a situation with a father who is estranged from 143 00:18:28,068 --> 00:18:30,310 his son -- they have no relationship at all. 144 00:18:30,413 --> 00:18:33,103 So I find it hard to believe that he would have sent his son 145 00:18:33,206 --> 00:18:35,965 over to the house to pick up some things, and he just leaves 146 00:18:36,068 --> 00:18:39,379 all of these things about his personal sex life out and about. 147 00:18:39,482 --> 00:18:41,689 Gillis's references to the whips 148 00:18:41,793 --> 00:18:45,000 and the chains and orgies and things of that nature 149 00:18:45,103 --> 00:18:47,241 I think really just gives us a window into 150 00:18:47,344 --> 00:18:52,655 how his leap into pornography addiction may have gone. 151 00:18:52,758 --> 00:18:54,448 It may have started with interests 152 00:18:54,551 --> 00:18:58,241 in sadomasochism and became increasingly more dark. 153 00:19:47,793 --> 00:19:50,620 I think the hands makes for a good story. 154 00:19:50,724 --> 00:19:52,103 It's too convenient. 155 00:19:52,206 --> 00:19:54,862 It fits together too cleanly -- his father left 156 00:19:54,965 --> 00:19:56,275 when he was one or two years old, 157 00:19:56,379 --> 00:19:58,206 and so he's just adopting this new story 158 00:19:58,310 --> 00:20:00,172 right before our very eyes in this interview. 159 00:20:00,275 --> 00:20:01,413 I don't find it credible. 160 00:20:01,517 --> 00:20:05,655 So I really take this as superficial attempts to look 161 00:20:05,758 --> 00:20:07,241 like he cares, like he has 162 00:20:07,344 --> 00:20:11,034 a sense of emotion or empathy, when in fact, he doesn't. 163 00:20:11,137 --> 00:20:12,793 BERRILL: He is feeling bad for himself, 164 00:20:12,896 --> 00:20:15,172 you know, feeling like he's nothing, 165 00:20:15,275 --> 00:20:18,689 and he levels the playing field by murdering 166 00:20:18,793 --> 00:20:20,689 and dismembering people. 167 00:20:20,793 --> 00:20:22,620 He can go from feeling bad about 168 00:20:22,724 --> 00:20:25,172 himself and terrible to feeling, uh, 169 00:20:25,275 --> 00:20:27,482 grandiose and powerful. 170 00:20:27,586 --> 00:20:31,724 It's a high and a low, and the end result is self-loathing. 171 00:20:31,827 --> 00:20:34,862 This is true of all, you know, serial murderers. 172 00:20:34,965 --> 00:20:36,241 It's like a cycle. 173 00:20:36,344 --> 00:20:38,448 So he is definitely a psychopath 174 00:20:38,551 --> 00:20:40,379 and a frightening person, 175 00:20:40,482 --> 00:20:43,241 and if not caught, predictably would continue 176 00:20:43,344 --> 00:20:44,827 to do what he did.